I don't justify myself.

Lutero:

I don't justify myself.

You claim to by faith alone.

God justifies us by faith.

But not by faith alone.

I have faith and God says we have been justified by faith (Romans 5:1).

We are justified by faith. But not by faith alone.

So we are justified by the law?

No. Those who keep the Law are justified by God.

Romans 3:20 - "Therefore NO ONE WILL BE DECLARED RIGHTEOUS IN HIS SIGHT BY OBSERVING THE LAW; through the law we become conscious of sin."

Keep reading.

Romans 3:
³¹Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

How do we establish the Law by denying it? 

Romans 2:13 - refers to the Jews who had the law and who heard the law.

It refers to everyone. Read the next verse:
Romans 2:14-15

King James Version (KJV)
¹⁴For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
¹⁵Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

It is not enough just to have the law. It is not enough just to hear the law. A person must DO (keep, obey) the law.

That is what I've been telling you.

Paul’s argument is very simple: The Jews had the law (possessed it), they heard the law, but they did not do the law, and therefore the Jews are condemned.

Wrong! Some of the Jews were condemned who JUSTIFIED THEMSELVES because they claimed to keep the Law:
Luke 18:9-11

King James Version (KJV)
⁹And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:

You continue to misinterpret this verse to support your works based false gospel. I claim faith "in Christ alone" for salvation.

You claim faith alone in Christ alone. And you have not yet produced one verse which says faith ALONE nor Christ ALONE. Christ Himself tells us to hear the Church (Matt 18:17) and says that those who hear His Church will also hear Him (Luke 10:16).

I am trusting in Him alone for salvation and not in my works. My faith does not remain alone in producing good works, so it's "not alone" in the sense which you are implying. Man is saved through faith and not by works; yet faith, if it is genuine, will be substantiated and confirmed by good works. You still don't get it.

It is you who don't get it. You cry, "faith ALONE" and then from the other side of your mouth you say, "my faith is not alone".

And you do not place your faith in Christ, you place your faith in your faith. You judge yourself saved, you trust in yourself.

We, on the other hand, trust only in Christ. We await His Judgement. You never hear a Catholic say, "I did this and did that, therefore God will save me." Nope. We don't measure our works as you measure your faith. We leave the measuring to God.

No, your faith is in yourself and your church. My faith is in Christ for salvation. This salvation is not of ourselves, it is the gift of God. Saved through faith, not works.

They whom Christ saves, will have exercised their faith in good works of love.

Notice that it doesn't say faith "and works"

Nor does it say faith alone.

and nobody has perfectly obeyed the Law so no one is justifed by the Law (Romans 3:20). You continue to misinterpret Romans 2:13.

I never said anyone was justified by the Law. But they who keep the Law are justified by God.

It's not about battle of the wits or what makes more sense to the natural man.

Precisely. The natural man justifies himself. We await the judgement of Christ. 

It doesn't make sense to you because you are looking at it from the angle of performance based salvation.

Nope. I am looking at it from the angle of a saving faith which is obedient to the Will of God. God doesn't justify those who do not keep the Law. That is the bottom line.

For we have been "past tense" saved through faith (Ephesians 2:8).

But not by faith ALONE. But by a faith which accomplishes the works God has prepared from the beginning (Eph 2:10),

Saved people are working out, not working for their salvation in the process of ongoing sanctification.

If they were saved, they would have nothing to fear:
Philippians 2:12

King James Version (KJV)
¹²Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

Fear and trembling is the attitude with which Christians are to pursue their ongoing Sanctification. It involves a healthy fear of offending God and a righteous awe and respect for Him (Proverbs 1:7; Psalm 34:9; Isaiah 66:2), not fear of going to hell if you don't live a sinless life. We are "working out" the salvation that we already have through FAITH in Christ, not working for the salvation that is not guaranteed until we work hard enough to receive it based on our accomplishments (works).

If they were saved, why did he worry about running in vain?
¹⁶Holding forth the word of life; that I may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither laboured in vain.

True. But I didn't say that and the Church doesn't teach that. So, that is your straw man.

That is what you keep accusing the Catholic Church of teaching, salvation by works. How can you deny it? In this message you've repeated it several times.

What straw man? You just said if you are already saved, you don't have to work out your salvation, yet you also said TRUE to my statement - not work for the salvation that we don't yet have. Which is it?

It is you who made both statements. You said:

We are to work out the salvation that we already have through faith in Christ, not work for the salvation that we don't yet have. The verse does not say, "work for your salvation." These Philippians had already been saved....

http://forums.carm.org/vbb/showthrea...=1#post2669379

IN THE PROCESS OF ONGOING SANCTIFICATION. Salvation has three tenses - 1. Justification 2. Sanctification 3. Glorification. We must not confuse these three tenses.

Justifiction, Sanctification and Glorification are simultaneous. The more one is cleansed of sins (justified), the more one is sanctified (becomes more holy) and the more one becomes Glorified ("divinized"; i.e. partake in the Divine nature; 2 Pet 1:4). 

You think that he admonishes lost people to do these things in order to become saved?

That's an amazing question. Did you not know that Christ came to save sinners?
Matthew 9:13

King James Version (KJV)
¹³But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

These things demonstrate that we are the sons of God and it also shines light in this world to others and our labor is not in vain in the Lord. In the day of Christ, it shall reap rejoicing and rewards.

Christ knows whose faith will reap rejoicing and rewards. Everyone's faith will be judged by their works.

You think that we become perfect within ourselves and that is the reason why we get to enter heaven?

It is God who justifies us, it is God who sanctifies us, therefore it is God who makes us perfect. 

Works salvation again.

There you go again with that ridiculous accusation. Are you going to deny it again? Yeah, that is your straw man. The Church teaches salvation by FAITH AND works. Not by faith alone. Not by works alone. FAITH AND works.

Verse 27 describes those whose sins have been washed away by the blood of Christ

Where do you get Christ's blood to wash your sins? Do you kill Him again?

and stand clothed in the righteousness of Christ.

God does not give his glory to another:
Psalm 97:6

King James Version (KJV)
⁶The heavens declare his righteousness, and all the people see his glory.

Isaiah 48:11

King James Version (KJV)
¹¹For mine own sake, even for mine own sake, will I do it: for how should my name be polluted? and I will not give my glory unto another.

That's why their names are written in the Lamb's book of life and why they get to enter heaven.

Here's why names are written in the Lamb's book of life:
Revelation 20:12

King James Version (KJV)
¹²And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

It's not because through the sanctification process they became sinless and perfect within themselves. We don't achieve sinless perfection within ourselves and that is not the means of our salvation. Is this where the Roman Catholic dogma of purgatory comes in? This doctrine denies the sufficiency of Christ's atonement on the cross for sins. How far did the thief on the cross make it in the process of ongoing sanctification when he was saved and died on the same day? Jesus said to him, this day you will be with me in paradise, not purgatory.

1. Purgatory is outside of time. 
2. The thief on the Cross suffered in the flesh:
1 Peter 4

¹Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;

3. And the Thief on the Cross, St. Dismas, also proclaimed Christ before men. Giving a wonderful testimony which has converted sinners throughout time. 
James 5:20

King James Version (KJV)
²⁰Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Therefore, he went very far in sanctification in that short time on the Cross with our Lord.

Please continue to prayerfully consider the truth and God bless.

You too,

Sincerely,

De Maria