TS:well then; let's clarify:

When a Protestants speak of "Faith" they are usually referring to true saving faith:
It seems when Catholics speak of Faith, they may not mean a faith that saves.(ie a dead faith)
Biblically speaking, that would be precisely the opposite.

A saving faith is accompanied by works:
James 2:14

King James Version (KJV)

14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

James 2:18

King James Version (KJV)

18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

True saving faith vs. dead faith vs. faithlessness
Good title.

James 2:26 refers to a faith that is dead :
Let's see what it says:

James 2:26

King James Version (KJV)

26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Faith without works is dead.

James 2:17 says that faith alone is dead:
James 2:17

King James Version (KJV)

17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Therefore faith alone is faith without works. Such a faith is dead and is not a true saving faith.

In James 2:26 the dead faith is the equivalent of no faith (faithlessness)
Nope. Faithlessness is not mentioned. Faith without works is dead. James 2:17 says that faith alone is dead. Faith alone is a faith without works. Go back to James 2:14 and you will see that faith without works does not save.

From the RCC perspective, they think that “dead faith” is still a faith, so therefore it is different than “faithlessness”.
From the CC perspective, they see “dead faith” as having more in common with “true saving faith” , than faithlessness
Neither faith alone, nor faith without works nor dead faith nor faithlessness save. Only faith working in love:

Galatians 5:6

King James Version (KJV)

For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

But actually that is a distinction without a difference.
Its a distinction YOU made. Not I.

(linguistic or conceptual distinction which is of no practical importance or which has no effect on meaning; a perceived difference where there is no actual difference)
You said it. So why did you bring it up?

From your perspective; you see a difference from you being brain-dead to you being brianless.

I do not.
Nope. YOU made that up. I never made a distinction between dead faith and faithlessness. YOU did it and then attributed it to me.

main point
From the Biblical perspective; dead faith and faithlessness (no faith) are the same.
That is also the Catholic perspective. Unless you can show the Catholic Church teaching that dead faith saves or that faithlessness saves. All you are doing is digging rabbit holes.

In other words: a distinction without a difference. (ie the same as no faith)

The characteristics and end results of dead faith and no faith are the same.
In context “dead faith”, and “faithlessness” are as far away from “true saving faith” as the east is from the west.
Agreed. So what? The fact remains that Scripture DEFINES faith alone as dead faith. And you hold to faith alone. Thus contradicting Scripture.

Protestants see no distinction between dead faith, faithlessness and no faith .

Protestants see a huge difference between true saving faith and dead faith.

In other words; dead faith is the opposite of true saving faith.
In other words; faithlessness, is the opposite of true saving faith
If your faith doesn't change you then your faith doesn't save you.

means that if your faith doesn't save you :it really is a dead faith which is the same as faithlessness

In James 2:26 the dead faith is the equivalent of no faith

The Catholic view
Faith + works --> salavation

The Protestant view
Faith --> salvation + works
The Biblical view:

James 2
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?


Works make faith perfect. Faith does not result in salvation. Faith must first be perfected in works before it can be a saving faith. That is why in v 14 St. James asks:
14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

If a man were saved first and then works result, he would not ask whether faith without works could save. Look at the next verse:

23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

Do you see how he says that "by works a man is justified"? Not by faith only.

Therefore, one must have faith and works before one is justified. That is the Biblical view. That is the Catholic view.


De Maria