When do you praise Mary? When do you pray to Mary?

De Maria said...

Hi Russell,

Its a small virtual world after all. I hope you've been well.

You said,

Russell said...
Greetings,

You said, “Why not ask Mary, of all people, to pray for you, just like you’d ask me to pray for you? The answer is because it is perfectly fine to ask people on earth to pray for you, but it’s NOT scriptural to ask those who have gone on.

That is not so. It is perfectly Scriptural to ask Mary for prayer or anything we want. The principal is perfectly Scriptural although not expressly written in Scripture.

1. Jesus Christ is our example. Do you deny it? If so, I will prove it from Scripture. If not, I'll move on.

2. Jesus Christ is the son of Mary. Do you deny it? If so, I will prove it from Scripture. If not, I will move on.

3. Now then, based upon those two Biblical truths, we conclude that we can ask Mary for anything. Because, Jesus, as the son of Mary, must have asked her for everything He needed in His life. Nourishment, clothing, love. In one word, EVERYTHING. Therefore, do the same as Jesus and you will be blessed.

There are more Biblical principals which bolster this teaching.

1. The Saints in heaven are alive. John 11:26
2. We are in communion with all the Saints. Rom 12:5
3. The prayer of the righteous is very efficacious. Job 42:7-9; James 5:16-17

You asked where we (Protestants) got the idea that we should ignore Mary. No one is ignoring Mary.

When do you praise Mary? When do you pray to Mary?

But there is a very big difference between acknowledging Mary as a humble servant, as the Bible portrays her, and offering prayer (“hyperdulia,” to be exact) to her.

There's a big difference between giving Mary the type of respect (hyperdulia) which the Scriptures demonstrate and the type of rejection of her which the Protestants offer. Read more.

If there were a biblical reason to do so, then Protestants would most likely be doing it also.

There is. But since the Protestants stand in rebellion to the Church, they also reject the Mother of the Church (Rev 12:17).


But in Scripture, only God is prayed to.

In Scripture, God the Father, Himself, sends an Angel to praise Mary. And God the Holy Spirit inspires a saintly woman to praise Mary. And Mary herself declares that all generations will praise her.

You said that Catholics don’t pray TO the saints, but rather, they ask the saints to pray for them.

Correct. In the sense that we don't adore the saints as though they were deities. We simply give the honor due to them. We know the difference between God and man.

But, according to official Catholic sources, it is a fact that Catholics are indeed encouraged to pray TO the saints (e.g., the Catechism of the Catholic Church #2679; the New Catholic Encyclopedia, Volume 11, p. 673; the New Advent Catholic Encyclopedia, online, under “Prayer”; Pope Pius IX’s “Ineffabilis Deus”). Anyone denying this is simply playing word games.

You. As most Protestants must play word games in order to justify their deficient theology and scholarship.

First, prayer has many meanings. It does not mean exclusively to worship. Look it up in a good dictionary.

pray verb \ˈprā\

Definition of PRAY

transitive verb
1: entreat, implore —often used as a function word in introducing a question, request, or plea ....

See this link on praying to the saints:....

God permitting, I will see you there. More likely, I will copy your posts and rebut them on my own blog.

Good to hear from you though. You know what? Our debates on my blog are by far the most popular webpages that I have. Of course, you and I sort of padded the number, but even if I take out our own posts, they are the most popular.

Good to speak to you again,

Sincerely,

De Maria