Affirming an infallible Magisterium

A fellow Catholic named James and I have been talking to PeacebyJesus (PbJ) over at the Catholicism website.

PbJ was throwing us off with some of his verbiage.  One of which was that "...an infallible magisterium is essential for recognizing spiritual Truth...."  A saying which is basically true.  Without the infallible Magisterium, we would go the way of the 10's of thousands of Protestant denominations.

However, PbJ was putting a twist on what he was intending the phrase to convey.  What he meant was that Catholics claim that no truth can be identified without the Magisterium.  Well, that's not true.  So I challenged him to provide the Catholic Doctrine which says such a thing.

And he said that the Jews had done just fine identifying the Scriptures without an infallible Magisterium before the advent of the Church.  Well, that's not true.  Because, before the advent of Jesus and the Church, the Jewish Scriptures were in disarray.  There were hundreds of Jewish books which the Jews considered Scripture.    It is because Jesus Christ used the Greek Septuagint version of the Old Testament that the Catholic Church also used it.  And it is because Jesus Christ used the Septuagint, that the Jews rejected it and chose to use on the books written in Hebrew.

Anyway, here's how I answered that part of his response to James.

De Maria  Peace By JESUS • 21 hours ago

Peace By JESUS James • an hour ago

The fact is that that by affirming than an infallible magisterium is essential for recognizing spiritual Truth, dissent from which cannot be allowed as valid, which souls did who believed OT men and Scriptures before there was a church of Rome, and thus believed itinerant Preaches who were in dissent from those who sat in the seat of Moses, then you have invalidated the church.

That's what James means about you writing mumbo-jumbo. Ok. Let's break it down:

The fact is that that by affirming than an infallible magisterium is essential for recognizing spiritual Truth,

The Catholic Teaching is that the infallible Magisterium:

890 The mission of the Magisterium is linked to the definitive nature of the covenant established by God with his people in Christ. It is this Magisterium's task to preserve God's people from deviations and defections and to guarantee them the objective possibility of professing the true faith without error. Thus, the pastoral duty of the Magisterium is aimed at seeing to it that the People of God abides in the truth that liberates. To fulfill this service, Christ endowed the Church's shepherds with the charism of infallibility in matters of faith and morals. The exercise of this charism takes several forms:

You're insinuating that Catholics claim that no truth can be identified without the Magisterium. I want you to provide the proof of that claim from an official Catholic Doctrine or admit that you have created a straw man which you continue to pound into the ground. But it has nothing to do with the True Catholic Doctrine.

Ok, let's move on to your next claim.

dissent from which cannot be allowed as valid,

That's true. God speaks through the Catholic Church. Therefore, if the Catholic Church has declared something true and someone disagrees, that person is disagreeing with God.

which souls did who believed OT men and Scriptures before there was a church of Rome,

Not so. You need to do a bit of more studying on the OT.

The Jews did not put together an OT in one volume until after the time of Christ. Because they couldn't identify them. Have you ever heard of
the Apocryphal Books of Moses, Enoch, Adam, David, Elias etc.? The Jews did not condemn them. The Magisterium of the Catholic Church condemned them. Not the OT Jews. If it wasn't for the Magisterium of the Catholic Church, the Jews probably wouldn't have a single volume work of Scripture, today.

and thus believed itinerant Preaches

The itinerant preachers were representatives of the Catholic Church. That can easily be proven. You don't believe that any man can represent God. Nor that any man can represent Christ. Yet, those itinerant preachers believed they were doing just that.

2 Corinthians 5:20King James Version (KJV)

20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

And they didn't go around proving anything by Scripture alone. They taught the Traditions of Jesus Christ and showed the truth of them in the Scriptures.

1 Thessalonians 2:13 For this cause also thank we God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God which ye heard of us, ye received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually worketh also in you that believe.

2 Thessalonians 2:15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

2 Thessalonians 3:6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.

Those are the three elements of Church Teaching. Tradition, Scripture as taught by the Magisterium.

who were in dissent from those who sat in the seat of Moses,

They weren't preaching because they were in disagreement with the Jews. They were preaching because they were sent by Christ so to do:

Matt 28:19-20

Matthew 28:19-20King James Version (KJV)

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

then you have invalidated the church.

Nope. You have made void the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ which He died upon the Cross to give to you. We submit to His Church and through the Church to Him who established it and authorized it to preach the Wisdom of God to all generations.